The Remarkable Leadership Podcast

00:00:08:20 - 00:00:33:22
Kevin Eikenberry
Authenticity is a word we throw around a lot, and we say we want it from our leaders and we expect it from ourselves. The problem is, it's hard to deliver something when we aren't exactly sure what it is. After this conversation with a master communicator, you will have a better idea of what it is and how it can be more useful for you and others.

00:00:34:04 - 00:00:54:08
Kevin Eikenberry
Welcome to another episode of the Remarkable Leadership Podcast, where we are helping leaders grow personally and professionally to lead more effectively and make a bigger, positive difference for their teams, organizations and the world. If you are listening to this podcast, you could join us in the future. Live! It's too late for this one, but in the future you could join us.

00:00:54:08 - 00:01:16:09
Kevin Eikenberry
Live and you means you need to know when those are happening. And the way to do that is to join one of our online groups, either on Facebook or LinkedIn. Those are two of the platforms we run the lives on, and those will both tell you when, where and how you can join us. Just go to remarkable podcast eCommerce, Facebook or remarkable podcast.com/linkedin.

00:01:16:11 - 00:01:38:19
Kevin Eikenberry
It doesn't matter which both of them will get you connected. Let you know when we're live so you can join us and get valuable information like today. Earlier, today's episode was brought to you by my latest book, Flexible Leadership Navigate Uncertainty and Lead with Confidence. It's time to realize that styles can get in our way, and that following our strengths might not always be the best approach.

00:01:38:21 - 00:02:02:02
Kevin Eikenberry
In a world more complex and uncertain than ever. Leaders need a new perspective and a new set of tools to create the great results their organizations and team members want and need. That's what flexible leadership can do for you and the leaders in your organization. Learn more and order your copy today at remarkable podcast.com/flexible. And now I'm going to bring in our guest.

00:02:02:07 - 00:02:19:00
Kevin Eikenberry
And before I introduce her I'm going to tell you I've got to bring something back up on top here so I can see it. There we go. I have to tell you and you will know why in a minute that of all the people I've interviewed, this is one that I'm a little bit nervous about. You'll understand why in a second.

00:02:19:02 - 00:02:48:18
Kevin Eikenberry
Jeanne Sparrow is a multi-hyphenate communicator. How about that phrase, everybody? She's hosted radio shows with media giants like Steve Harvey, George Wallace and Danny Bonaduce, and hosted her own daily morning TV talk show for seven years. Currently, she hosts a weekly radio show on V 103, the top rated iHeart radio station in Chicago, and hosts the Fearless Authenticity with Jeanne Spero podcast on the iHeart Podcast Network.

00:02:48:23 - 00:03:11:23
Kevin Eikenberry
She appears regularly on top rated Chicago TV stations as a fill in host and guest. She's a long time voiceover artist doing hundreds of commercials for national brands as an actor, in commercials and on broadcast TV, like on Fox's Empire. Chicago Med, Magnum, P.I.. Do you? Are you starting to see why? I'm just a little bit intimidated about this particular episode.

00:03:11:23 - 00:03:38:06
Kevin Eikenberry
She has spoken to and consulted with many not for profit and public corporations, and she teaches graduate level courses at Northwestern's School of Communication. She is the author of Fearless Authenticity, Lead Better, Sell More, and Speak Sensationally. And that's probably largely what we're going to talk about today. As the title of this session tells you. Jane, welcome to my guest.

00:03:38:07 - 00:03:42:07
Jeanne Sparrow
Thank you so much for having me. It is an honor to be here.

00:03:42:09 - 00:04:02:18
Kevin Eikenberry
I'm already feeling judged. Everybody okay, so, let's just dive right in. So you've done all this stuff. That tells us a little bit about your journey, but tell us a little bit. I mean, I know more because I've read the book and and we've got a lot of ground to cover. But tell us a little bit about your journey and then sort of how it ends up with this book.

00:04:02:19 - 00:04:07:12
Kevin Eikenberry
Well, fill in a couple of the blanks in, in the story. And then why this book?

00:04:07:14 - 00:04:28:05
Jeanne Sparrow
So as I started talking at a very young age and I haven't set up since, and that's pretty much the essence of who I am and what I do. And I've just found different ways to do it. But I have learned that the ability to take skills from one place and apply them to another is a the reason why we stay successful.

00:04:28:05 - 00:04:39:14
Jeanne Sparrow
And through my podcast, I have learned that through all the people that I talk to that are also in the book. That's the reason why I started the podcast to begin with, to get more material for my book and to.

00:04:39:14 - 00:04:41:11
Kevin Eikenberry
Inside Baseball everybody.

00:04:41:12 - 00:04:59:03
Jeanne Sparrow
Right. And also to prove to myself that my theory was correct, because what I learned along the way in my career in broadcast that I found out a lot of people outside of our world didn't know, is that who we are is the gift that we have to share with people. And it's also where we find our success.

00:04:59:08 - 00:05:22:05
Jeanne Sparrow
But we often believe that, you know, we have to do things to deserve that. And we often believe that the world is telling us that who we are is not enough. And, you know, I struggle with that myself. I mean, all of us have, you know, there's some article recently out that imposter syndrome is like at 100% in, in C suites across the country because people like try to figure out how they got where they are.

00:05:22:05 - 00:05:46:08
Jeanne Sparrow
And I think part of that is because we, we even though our parents told us that we are enough, that we will find our people, that we don't actually believe it, and we have to go through some things to do that. So, when I was politely invited to find my success elsewhere after my last show, which, was was canceled.

00:05:46:10 - 00:05:47:08
Jeanne Sparrow
I started looking.

00:05:47:08 - 00:06:06:10
Kevin Eikenberry
Away for a second because I was looking I know that I'm doing an upcoming show with someone about the imposter syndrome. Oh, good. And I know that we've done a couple in the past, and so we'll put all those in the show notes. I wasn't, but I promise you, I wasn't, ignoring you. So, so when you were told you were released, see your next opportunity, go ahead.

00:06:06:10 - 00:06:25:13
Jeanne Sparrow
And I was invite. Yes. I was invited to find success elsewhere. I started my own business because I had been wanting to and had never quite figured out what it was going to be. But one thing I did learn when I went back to school was that there were things we knew inside broadcasting that other people didn't know about, how we connect, how we communicate.

00:06:25:15 - 00:06:49:05
Jeanne Sparrow
And I realized when I was in grad school that it was about leadership, like it was about how we take the things we know, transfer them to other people and and inspire them to act and to act in a way that gets us closer to our goals. And so that's where the impetus, like somebody had to convince me to write the book.

00:06:49:10 - 00:07:09:12
Jeanne Sparrow
But that was where the impetus was to create the system that is now the foundation of the book. Because once I started working with people, I realized how much, how many secrets we held inside broadcasting that I assumed everybody knew, because everybody in my industry knew them too well.

00:07:09:12 - 00:07:30:10
Kevin Eikenberry
Because the people you were around see, we as leaders have that problem all the time. There's a whole bunch of stuff that we know, we assume everybody else knows, so we don't tell anybody. And that is a serious problem. You know, it's interesting, Gina, as I'm listening to you, I'm thinking. And so a little inside baseball back in terms of the show, you know, and not just for you, but for everybody, you know, there if you're a long time listener.

00:07:30:10 - 00:08:03:05
Kevin Eikenberry
Watcher, viewer, I guess is a better word. You you know that sometimes we have books that you would absolutely say, well, that's a leadership book, right? And sometimes we have we have guests where it's really very much about the US as individuals and how that connects to us as leaders. And then sometimes and by the way, all of those kinds of books do connect to us as leaders, because as we become a better leader, we become better human and vice versa.

00:08:03:07 - 00:08:24:23
Kevin Eikenberry
But the third thing is, and that's where I think this book falls, is this is a book that while while the word lead is in the subtitle, it's not really a book, just about certainly not capital L leadership, positional leadership. And and yet it's about a topic that's incredibly, incredibly important to leaders, that being authenticity. So you we're we're able to have this conversation today.

00:08:24:23 - 00:08:40:09
Kevin Eikenberry
I think that sort of hooks those things all together. And so for those of you that are listening now, you know a little bit about why I picked, to have Jean on the show when they pitched us her book. So, we should probably start here. What's your definition of authenticity?

00:08:40:11 - 00:09:12:15
Jeanne Sparrow
Oh, it's a good one. As in the question that is in the question, I hope. I hope that my answer is good authenticity in in the way I see it in work, whether that as a leader or as a rising leader or as somebody who, you know, coaches, mentors, both of those authentic beauty is bringing all of your experiences to your work in a way that advances your work forward.

00:09:12:17 - 00:09:46:22
Jeanne Sparrow
So I like to tell a story that is in the book about how who we are personally impacts what we do, and actually adds to the experience of what what our goals are trying to to get to. And I had a, producer we were it was back in the day, like, I don't know when when autism was first being discussed publicly as, a spectrum disorder, like it was, you know, it had gone through so many, levels of awareness.

00:09:46:22 - 00:10:06:06
Jeanne Sparrow
Right. And the autism Autism Awareness Month, I believe, was called something different at that time. But we were trying because we served a lot of women as our viewers. We wanted to do, you know, a series about that to raise awareness and to help moms who were trying to figure out what might be going on with their children.

00:10:06:08 - 00:10:39:13
Jeanne Sparrow
So we start brainstorming in one of our meetings, and we think, we we think we're cooking, right? We think we got all we are popping on all eight cylinders, and one of our producers goes, wait, my two kids just got diagnosed on the spectrum, and everything we just talked about is irrelevant and not helpful. And we were all like, hey, because we didn't know her children were on the spectrum, and two, because we didn't realize we thought we were doing something good.

00:10:39:13 - 00:10:46:20
Jeanne Sparrow
And we in that moment, I think we all realized that we could have either embarrassed ourselves.

00:10:46:22 - 00:10:47:23
Kevin Eikenberry
Offended.

00:10:48:01 - 00:11:16:21
Jeanne Sparrow
That you wanted to have first and depth, and then the third piece is done the exact opposite of what we had intended to do. And in those moments when we can bring our personal experiences to bear in our work, then we can do what we came there to do. We can amplify the things that we want to amplify and impact people the way that we want to and and reach the goals that we intended.

00:11:16:23 - 00:11:38:12
Jeanne Sparrow
And if I'm not mistaken, I think we ended up getting some some award nominations for that series after we had all done it and we could have fallen flat on our face. But that person deciding to be authentic at work. And here's the thing she didn't have to disclose that her children were on the spectrum to be able.

00:11:38:16 - 00:11:43:22
Jeanne Sparrow
She could have just said, I know something about this, and we're wrong, and here's why.

00:11:43:22 - 00:11:52:03
Kevin Eikenberry
But but, but and and and had she taken that approach, it might not have had the impact on all of, you.

00:11:52:04 - 00:11:54:03
Jeanne Sparrow
Know, it wouldn't have. But I mean.

00:11:54:04 - 00:11:57:22
Kevin Eikenberry
It probably would have changed. It probably would have changed your series. But maybe you.

00:11:57:22 - 00:12:18:06
Jeanne Sparrow
Could have had. Yeah. Yeah, it still could have had an impact. And that's and that's really what this is about, what she did in that moment. Because this wasn't even her. You know, she wasn't the one even pitching the idea. Right. It was somebody else's idea. But she made that idea better. She amplified how that whole thing turned out.

00:12:18:11 - 00:12:46:02
Jeanne Sparrow
But here's the thing. I want people to know, Kevin, what happens? And and we make these decisions every day. What happens when we sit in a meeting, when we know better and we sit silent and a lot of times that choice is determined by how the leader makes it possible for that kind of conversation to happen.

00:12:46:04 - 00:13:09:01
Kevin Eikenberry
Yeah. There's two sides. Yes, 100%. Everybody. Thank you for that, Gene. And there's there's two parts to that. There's, there's us thinking about that when we're in that meeting. There's us thinking about that when we're in the meeting and we're the leader, because then sometimes we may need to share that, but we need to make sure we're not going first because we want to make sure we're not overwhelming what else might show up.

00:13:09:06 - 00:13:27:17
Kevin Eikenberry
And the third thing I would say is, are we making it safe for people to make the conscious choice in that meeting? So, you know, Gene, you asked it as in the first person for me as an individual in that meeting. And I'm just saying there's two there's two examples there when I'm, when I have the boss hat on and when I don't.

00:13:27:19 - 00:13:49:03
Kevin Eikenberry
But the third thing is so important, like if are we can we make it safe for people to do that? You. The book is titled Fearless Authenticity, and this example I think gets at that a little bit. Yeah. I'd like you to say a little bit more about why fearless?

00:13:49:05 - 00:14:06:23
Jeanne Sparrow
Because it takes courage to stand where you are and say who you are or or even more importantly, show who you are when we are pressed, like, think about when you were a kid, right your first day.

00:14:07:01 - 00:14:08:18
Kevin Eikenberry
That was a long time ago.

00:14:08:20 - 00:14:14:20
Jeanne Sparrow
Same same star, same. Back when we were in school, it was called junior high, not middle school.

00:14:14:21 - 00:14:18:14
Kevin Eikenberry
You you are so correct about that.

00:14:18:16 - 00:14:25:16
Jeanne Sparrow
I remember when I was in eighth grade, it switched to middle school and I was like, what's a middle school? What is a middle school?

00:14:25:22 - 00:14:29:13
Kevin Eikenberry
But he was freaking out about going to high school as I was at.

00:14:29:18 - 00:14:46:00
Jeanne Sparrow
Well, you know what? Can I tell you something I wasn't and I was I got you. No, no, no, let me check. Listen, I'm very easy to get off track, but I will get us back to where we were going. So I actually lived in a town where it was a fairly small town in southwest Louisiana called New Iberia.

00:14:46:00 - 00:14:48:02
Jeanne Sparrow
It's where they make the Tabasco sauce. I always get.

00:14:48:03 - 00:14:49:10
Kevin Eikenberry
Asked. Yes.

00:14:49:15 - 00:15:04:03
Jeanne Sparrow
So we had a freshman high school because the way that the schools were integrated way back in the day, the number of students that were there, it just couldn't at that time. Right? Yeah, exactly. I didn't have that.

00:15:04:03 - 00:15:11:23
Kevin Eikenberry
I had I got dropped right in. And of course it was a small school, but still I'm still a little bit freaked out. I'm just being honest. I don't think I've ever said that out loud before.

00:15:12:01 - 00:15:38:07
Jeanne Sparrow
Well, I didn't have. The reason why I wasn't freaked out is because we had a school that was freshmen only. So by the time you got, you got to build enough confidence before you went to the big high school, ten through 12. And so for me, it was a little bit easier. And that's the reason why I see junior high as the big like I got to put on my big girl pants now like I'm at the I, you know, and and here's the other thing.

00:15:38:07 - 00:16:00:20
Jeanne Sparrow
I went from Catholic school to public school and so I went from a much smaller schooling situation into a larger I mean, it wasn't huge, but it was large to me where I, you know, had to make some new friends and, and do some things. But I think for everybody, junior high is kind of where you start to.

00:16:00:20 - 00:16:08:07
Jeanne Sparrow
So our middle school was where you start to show your personality, you start you because you know yourself better at that point. But it is also.

00:16:08:07 - 00:16:09:19
Kevin Eikenberry
You think you do you think you did.

00:16:10:00 - 00:16:31:08
Jeanne Sparrow
But you know yourself better than you did when you were five, right? But the thing is, is you also care more about what other people think because you are unsure. You are looking around for cues to see if what you're feeling is normal, to see if you are normal. And that is when we really start to feel inside outside groups.

00:16:31:10 - 00:17:00:16
Jeanne Sparrow
I think it's happening younger now, but I think all of us can identify with that feeling of fear, you know, or at least hesitation of who we are, where we fit in and what we are willing to do to feel like we belong. And it takes courage and being fearless to say, you know what? This is who I am, and starting new jobs or new positions brings back those same feelings at some degree.

00:17:00:18 - 00:17:19:20
Kevin Eikenberry
That's exactly what I was going to say. Like. So again, if you're moving into a new role, you've probably experienced that. But as a leader, when you bring people into your team, you aren't necessarily thinking about the fact that that's going on for them, because everything, it's all it's all known to you. It's not known to them.

00:17:19:20 - 00:17:41:20
Kevin Eikenberry
I think it's a really good point. I think we can have an entire show just about that transition that we all had as kids. Even though my experience was quite different than yours. There was no freshman center. There was it was there was not even any new people. We went to the high school. My freak out was about the sophomores, juniors and and supposedly the seniors like this is going to be different and all that.

00:17:41:20 - 00:17:59:09
Kevin Eikenberry
Like, we could have a whole show. They're tying it to this bigger point, but maybe another day. I want to get to do some more stuff in the book. Early in the book, you talk about something that your dad taught you about authenticity. He said three things. What were those three things?

00:17:59:11 - 00:18:01:17
Jeanne Sparrow
Oh, I don't remember. Hold.

00:18:01:17 - 00:18:04:03
Kevin Eikenberry
Up. I'm here. The right below. Here they are.

00:18:04:05 - 00:18:08:14
Jeanne Sparrow
Oh, that those three things. Okay, those three things. Because let me tell you something, Kevin.

00:18:08:15 - 00:18:11:12
Kevin Eikenberry
I told you it wasn't going to be Mike Wallace. I wasn't trying to trip you up.

00:18:11:13 - 00:18:14:10
Jeanne Sparrow
My dad, he told me a lot of things. Well.

00:18:14:10 - 00:18:15:00
Kevin Eikenberry
Fair.

00:18:15:03 - 00:18:33:21
Jeanne Sparrow
My dad. He told me a lot of things. I have a whole series on social media about the stuff that my father has told me. Okay, so, yes, three things you need to have to be authentic. To be fair, it was first, you have to be brave. That's where the courage comes in, right? You got to take that step.

00:18:33:23 - 00:19:02:22
Jeanne Sparrow
Then you have to be free enough to be able to express yourself, right. It can't just be fearless and standing on business silently, right? You have to actually be free enough to express, not only feel it, but express it to other people. And then finally, you just need to be you. But you have to know who you are.

00:19:02:23 - 00:19:12:22
Kevin Eikenberry
And exactly. And I think that's where we'll spend the rest of our time. Right. So like it's really important. I mean, it's easy to say, be brave, be free, be you.

00:19:13:00 - 00:19:14:01
Jeanne Sparrow
It's a good look. Say it though.

00:19:14:02 - 00:19:32:03
Kevin Eikenberry
Admit it. It is. It's good. It's really good. But at that. But in the open, I said, you know, sometimes we all talk about this like we ought to be authentic, and yet we don't always know what that really means. And it starts with our identity. Right. And that's what you're talking about now is how does this all connect.

00:19:32:03 - 00:19:40:02
Kevin Eikenberry
And and so our identity and our authenticity. Right. So do you have it. Go ahead.

00:19:40:04 - 00:20:08:23
Jeanne Sparrow
I will even drill it down further from there. It's about your value and your values, right. The value you bring, what you have to offer. Because you know this. If I learned nothing from my parents, both of them were always of service, always offering something that they had. My mother was a musician. She played in the church choir.

00:20:08:23 - 00:20:32:02
Jeanne Sparrow
She taught chorus. She, you know, she shared her gifts and love for music with everyone. My dad was always. He was always driving miss Daisy. Always. Like there was always some little old lady in the back seat taking them to go, to go, as we used to say in Louisiana, go make groceries, to go to church, to go to mass, wherever.

00:20:32:04 - 00:20:35:16
Jeanne Sparrow
My daddy was that person. He was always the one.

00:20:35:18 - 00:20:39:05
Kevin Eikenberry
Who was your at your home accent just came out in that moment.

00:20:39:06 - 00:20:50:10
Jeanne Sparrow
I know I've been in Chicago so long, but sometimes Louisiana will come flying out of my mouth because as a broadcaster, you can't. We have a standard accent.

00:20:50:12 - 00:21:14:04
Kevin Eikenberry
Right? And so that's a really interesting point too. Right. So being and that's I think right there is one of the things that people get stuck with. Right, as a leader, not that's not stuck with but stuck around like they may be someone listening, may be thinking, well, is is is Jean really authentic? If she's if she's had to change the way she talks.

00:21:14:06 - 00:21:25:05
Kevin Eikenberry
Because how we talk is who we are. So like just take that as because I think that's just a kernel of an example of how authentic might not always mean exactly what we think it means.

00:21:25:11 - 00:21:46:03
Jeanne Sparrow
So I believe we all live in a range of authenticity, and it looks different for different people who I am and how I speak. And and it's interesting because this conversation about code switching has come up quite a bit. And for and for people who don't know, code switching, at least for black people, is speaking a certain way in in your inner group.

00:21:46:05 - 00:22:10:12
Jeanne Sparrow
Then you do say in a group that is mixed right. And that I equate that to you might talk in a certain way when you're with your guy friends at the bar watching football or basketball or whatever your sport is, and speak very differently to your wife, to your daughter, or to your grandmother, let's take it back. You know, you're going to like.

00:22:10:15 - 00:22:12:11
Jeanne Sparrow
And when I'm talking to a girlfriend.

00:22:12:13 - 00:22:14:21
Kevin Eikenberry
It's like, let's just speak.

00:22:14:22 - 00:22:28:22
Jeanne Sparrow
When we're talking in one place to peers, we're going to talk very differently to our elders. But are you a different person? Absolutely not. In fact, your grandmother probably knows about the colorful language you use when you're in the in.

00:22:28:22 - 00:22:32:17
Kevin Eikenberry
If you're assuming that I use colorful language, Gina, let's be careful here.

00:22:32:17 - 00:22:34:09
Jeanne Sparrow
I'm speaking to the audience.

00:22:34:13 - 00:22:36:15
Kevin Eikenberry
Oh, okay. Fair. No, I'm not.

00:22:36:15 - 00:22:45:14
Jeanne Sparrow
Making any assumptions. There is somebody out there who uses color for language that his grandmother may be aware of, but that he would never say to his grandmother.

00:22:45:16 - 00:23:08:01
Kevin Eikenberry
I actually a conversation about that word using the word damn with my grandmother once, and I said, you can say you can say a different word. And it's the thought underneath it is exactly the same shoes. It doesn't matter. I'm still not going to say it, anyway, but I know I think that's a great example. I mean, I'm glad that we just took that little detour, because I think that's a perfect example that that that doesn't change who we are.

00:23:08:03 - 00:23:32:16
Kevin Eikenberry
And and you are, I'm confident, based on our short conversation and having read your book, and we're talking with Jean Spero about her new book, fearless Authenticity, I'm confident in saying this, that you are supremely proud of your kid hood, and supremely comfortable letting that South Louisiana accent come back out. And that that doesn't mean that.

00:23:32:16 - 00:23:35:16
Jeanne Sparrow
And that's the other piece. We're sorry.

00:23:35:18 - 00:23:36:17
Kevin Eikenberry
No. Go ahead.

00:23:36:19 - 00:23:52:10
Jeanne Sparrow
I was like everybody else who doesn't understand a South Louisiana accent, I, I had to interpret from my my grandmother's first language was Creole French. So we had to, you know, put somebody culture someplace else. And you hear all the sighs, the babies and the blah, blah, blah. Honey, they're not hearing it.

00:23:52:12 - 00:23:53:05
Kevin Eikenberry
Exactly.

00:23:53:05 - 00:23:54:21
Jeanne Sparrow
So I'm sorry I interrupted.

00:23:54:23 - 00:24:16:06
Kevin Eikenberry
No, no, that's okay. We have to we have to get at, the foundation in the book. You mentioned it earlier, and and I'm a little bit careful. I want to be a little bit careful on our time, but I want you really to get to this foundation again, a three part phrase, and I'll just put it on the screen for those watching live it, tell it, sell it.

00:24:16:11 - 00:24:32:01
Kevin Eikenberry
Because again, I don't know that a lot of people would initially put the word sell it with authenticity. So can you just unpack this a little bit? Not too much, because everyone needs to go make sure they go buy a copy of the book. But when you say live it, tell it, sell it. What are you talking about?

00:24:32:03 - 00:25:03:05
Jeanne Sparrow
Those are my foundations for success. And it's how I see the way all of our interactions as people go. Because here's that. Here's the bottom line, Kevin. Everything we do is in that, that we are trying to produce at work, to reach goals has to involve working with other people, whether that is an active, sales effort to external stakeholders, let's call them, or whether that's internally organizing to get some process going.

00:25:03:05 - 00:25:27:20
Jeanne Sparrow
Right. Those these three things need to happen live. It is about you and understanding how you affect other people and and where you are and what you have to bring to the table. It is about the way you connect with other people. It's the stories that link us together, the stories we tell about what we're doing, how we're going to do it, and where we're going and then sell it is this idea that a lot of people have had resistance to that.

00:25:27:20 - 00:25:41:14
Jeanne Sparrow
I don't understand because we are always selling something. As I like to say, even if it's what you're going to cook for dinner. And anybody who has teenage children knows this intimately.

00:25:41:16 - 00:26:08:13
Kevin Eikenberry
Well, if you want them to eat it anyway. So, so, so, yes. So you'll get a lot more about the idea. And we've been talking about live it and obviously because if you when you have your copy of the book, you're, you're hearing from a experienced communicator in a variety of media, and you're going to get a lot of ideas around the, tell it and the communication piece and then the sell a piece you just mentioned.

00:26:08:15 - 00:26:28:06
Kevin Eikenberry
I want to I want to keep us on authenticity as we start to wrap up. And we bumped up against something a couple of times. But I want to bring this word out because it's a really important word as it relates to authenticity. And that's confidence. I mean, you've talked about we've talked about being fearless, and we talked about being willing.

00:26:28:08 - 00:26:46:22
Kevin Eikenberry
But if we want to be more authentic in the ways that we've talked about, confidence has to play a role. I mean, you've used the word fearless, you've used the word brave. But we don't always think about those words in the same way as we do confidence. So talk to us a minute about how you connect confidence in authenticity.

00:26:47:00 - 00:27:12:15
Jeanne Sparrow
I believe confidence comes through authenticity, true authenticity in understanding what your worth is. So when you know what lane you drive in, you can drive as fast and as long as you'd like because you're not trying to switch lanes, you're not trying to get off the road and get back on. And granite to understand what that is, sometimes you do have to switch lanes, get off and get back on the highway.

00:27:12:17 - 00:27:39:04
Jeanne Sparrow
But I believe when you explore what value you have to offer other people, what thing you have to be of service in, you can lean into that in a way that gives you confidence. When you know what you bring to the table, you start to walk differently. You start to talk differently. You start to understand where you fit in relationship to other people, and you're no longer in competition.

00:27:39:04 - 00:28:04:04
Jeanne Sparrow
A lot of people get false confidence, and sometimes that can elevate to arrogance when they compare right with other people. I'm better than so-and-so at this. The problem with that is, as my mama used to tell me, there will always be somebody smarter, somebody prettier, somebody faster, somebody you know, somebody better than you. Always. There will always be somebody like that.

00:28:04:04 - 00:28:27:13
Jeanne Sparrow
So if you only get your confidence from the way that you are comparing yourself to others, eventually that confidence is going to get knocked down because it's not based on anything solid or real. And if you do find your confidence through what is inside of you, it is far more steady. It is far more durable, it is far more sustainable.

00:28:27:15 - 00:28:32:09
Jeanne Sparrow
And that's how I see confidence and authenticity. And did I lose you, Kevin?

00:28:32:11 - 00:28:36:02
Kevin Eikenberry
No, you didn't lose me. I'm still not with you. I just know that the camera's not working.

00:28:36:04 - 00:28:37:11
Jeanne Sparrow
Okay. That's all right.

00:28:37:13 - 00:28:59:16
Kevin Eikenberry
Has has frozen. So, it's a lovely place that it froze for all of you that are watching, I apologize. I for those of you listening, it doesn't matter. The thing that I love about what you just said, Gene, is this idea that. If we're we're saying we're saying we want to be fearless. We say, like, how to be confident, to be fearless.

00:28:59:21 - 00:29:18:19
Kevin Eikenberry
And yet, the starting point here is clarity about self. And when we have the clarity, the confidence will be there. And so it's not like it's not like we have to muster the confidence. We have to let let the clarity show the confidence through, if that makes sense.

00:29:18:21 - 00:29:39:19
Jeanne Sparrow
100%. I often tell people, that I'm training and working with that we end up sometimes doubting ourselves. And especially it happens at midlife, where you let you look up one day and you go, how did I get here? And then we get on this whole tangent of, I gotta find purpose in my work and this and that and other.

00:29:40:00 - 00:30:03:02
Jeanne Sparrow
The reality is, is that if you are stepping into who you are and you understand your value and what you have to offer, your purpose will find you. You just keep doing what you do well, what you know that you are here to offer other people, and the value that you can transfer from yourself to somebody else in service of some, you know, goal that you have together.

00:30:03:05 - 00:30:28:01
Jeanne Sparrow
Hopefully a higher, greater good. But even if it's just to get through the end of the day, like literally if you have that, then you can you can sustain the whole journey and it will all find you. I think a lot of times we chase things, not realizing that things run away when we chase them. And the same thing is true of purpose and of confidence.

00:30:28:01 - 00:30:41:17
Jeanne Sparrow
But when we find that kernel inside ourselves, then we are able to do that. And here's the most beautiful part about it, Kevin, is that when we do that, we give other people permission and encouragement to do the same.

00:30:41:22 - 00:30:59:12
Kevin Eikenberry
To do the same 100%. So we had a little technical difficulty when we when we were doing this live. So hopefully this isn't too out of sorts for all of you that are listening to the podcast later. But this is for you because we wanted to give you, all of the wisdom of Jeannie. So, so, so, Jean, here's the question.

00:30:59:13 - 00:31:02:20
Kevin Eikenberry
What didn't I ask that you wish I would have?

00:31:02:22 - 00:31:34:13
Jeanne Sparrow
It's not so much a question, but it's a point that you touched on that I wanted to expand on. We talk about fearless authenticity, and I think a lot of people look at the book for individual development, which it is. It is absolutely about who you are and how you contribute to the greater whole. But one of the things I really want to bring forth is something I've been seeing in my work as a trainer and as a speaker, and in just having conversations with people, is that the higher we go up as leaders, the less we are being authentic across the board.

00:31:34:13 - 00:31:54:07
Jeanne Sparrow
Even if we are authentic and we think about how we impact people up and down our flow as as a leader, we forget about how that happens across. And a lot of times when you have people of similar power structure, in the same room, there's a lot of masks on because we have to show our power. Right.

00:31:54:09 - 00:32:16:22
Jeanne Sparrow
And the problem is, is that in a time when innovation is of immediate necessity because of the speed at which our world is progressing and changing every day, we do not have the time to not be fearless and to not be authentic with each other, because that is how we will solve problems, solve them quickly and reach the goals that we are reaching for.

00:32:17:01 - 00:32:21:23
Jeanne Sparrow
And maybe even tackle some things that we weren't expecting to.

00:32:22:01 - 00:32:34:17
Kevin Eikenberry
I love that. So a couple of things before we go that are not related to the book, but are more just about you, I want to know, Jean, what you do for fun.

00:32:34:19 - 00:32:38:23
Jeanne Sparrow
Oh, okay. So I love my work so much. It is hard to separate the two.

00:32:39:00 - 00:32:46:21
Kevin Eikenberry
And that is an unfair answer. I know that one's been listening to this, has already figured that out. I want more than that.

00:32:46:23 - 00:33:12:12
Jeanne Sparrow
So what do I do for fun? Can I tell you something I love good food, good wine, and good conversation. When I tell you that I do what I do for a living because I would do it for free. Like that's the secret that I don't tell anybody. But my favorite thing is to sit around with my friends and just talk about what's happening in their lives, in the world, like if I can have a good conversation.

00:33:12:12 - 00:33:28:21
Jeanne Sparrow
Kevin, I am happy. I also like to dance. I used to be a pretty doggone good salsa dancer, and I need to get back in shape for that, because let me tell you some, it takes some serious. It takes some serious lung power to be a good salsa dancer.

00:33:28:23 - 00:33:34:08
Kevin Eikenberry
Well, the good news is you did do this for free. So, hopefully it was a good conversation.

00:33:34:08 - 00:33:35:02
Jeanne Sparrow
It absolutely.

00:33:35:02 - 00:33:39:02
Kevin Eikenberry
Was. What are you. What are you reading these days?

00:33:39:04 - 00:34:02:08
Jeanne Sparrow
So I am reading. I am trying to finish Atomic Habits. I know I'm so late on it, but here's the thing that's really interesting. Like, I'm a systems person, but it's very difficult for me to, to create them, right? I like I, I see things in systems, but for myself, in my personal life, it can get a little chaotic.

00:34:02:08 - 00:34:31:13
Jeanne Sparrow
Because as you've noticed, when you did my, bio intro, I do a lot of different things because that's how my brain works. But I see them all as the same thing, like other people see them as a bunch of different jobs. I see them all on a continuum, so I need to get better. As a as an entrepreneur with how, structured and ritual ritual that I am around, how I operate my business and conduct myself.

00:34:31:13 - 00:34:39:08
Jeanne Sparrow
And I feel like I Atomic Habits has the answer for me, but I haven't finished it yet.

00:34:39:10 - 00:34:55:04
Kevin Eikenberry
There's a in my in my book. I talk in my latest book, I talk a little bit about the difference between and and James Clear does that in Atomic Habits. Do the difference between habits and rituals? I think rituals are really important for us, you know, which go beyond routines. And I think it's a really important piece.

00:34:55:04 - 00:35:05:03
Kevin Eikenberry
I'm glad that you brought that up. So we've talked about somebody else's book. Where can people learn more about your work? Where can they get your book? Where do you want to point people before we finish up.

00:35:05:05 - 00:35:30:18
Jeanne Sparrow
Fearless authenticity.com/book. It is where all of the links to the book are listed, including the audio book, which just came out a couple of weeks ago. So I hope that everybody will go there. And it's also how you connect with me on social media. I'm fairly active on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, and sometimes the platform formerly known as Twitter.

00:35:30:20 - 00:35:43:05
Jeanne Sparrow
I can't let it go. You can find me all those places and interact, and I talk about things that are in the book. And of course with my podcast and the link to that is on the website as well.

00:35:43:07 - 00:36:05:16
Kevin Eikenberry
Perfect. Jean Spero, before we go, everybody have a question I want to ask you. It's the question if you've been here before, you know, I'm going to ask because I ask it every single week. It's a routine. It's a ritual. I love it. And the question is, now what? So you got the chance to hear from Jean and hopefully hear that we enjoy each other's conversate and the conversation and the ideas.

00:36:05:18 - 00:36:25:02
Kevin Eikenberry
And so maybe it was entertaining. Fine. That's not why you came. Really. You came here to leave. Figuring out a little bit more about being authentic, or maybe figuring out how you connect. Authenticity with your role as a leader when you have a leader head on. Or maybe you're just thinking about this as a human and not necessarily only from your leader role.

00:36:25:02 - 00:36:45:14
Kevin Eikenberry
The point is, until you ask an answer the question, now what? What am I going to do with this? It will just be an entertaining conversation. And so my challenge to you is to think back, what did you get from this conversation? What action will you take as a result? And when you do that, this will have been much more valuable for you.

00:36:45:16 - 00:36:53:04
Kevin Eikenberry
Jean, thank you so much for being here and for putting up with our technical challenges before we got to the end. It was such a pleasure to spend time with you.

00:36:53:06 - 00:37:01:04
Jeanne Sparrow
It was lovely to spend time with you, technical issues, and it reminded me of my work days and television. Trust me, trust me.

00:37:01:06 - 00:37:16:11
Kevin Eikenberry
So everybody, we'll be back next. If you enjoyed this, make sure you're liking and subscribing and referring from whatever platform you're watching or listening this on right? And then make sure you're back next week for another episode of Remarkable The Remarkable Leadership Podcast. We'll see you then.